What’s going on with you right now?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: Well, I dropped the Roxanne and I just say Shante when referring to myself. Shante right now has a private practice. She’s a psychologist. I don’t like the title psycho therapist because it sounds like crazy people needing therapy. So, I have a private practice that I run in the evenings. It’s also very lucrative and I own a publishing company.

Tell me about your publishing company?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: I own all of the rights to all of my publishing’s. I have all of my rights to all of my publishing’s, which very few rappers can say that they have or that they own. I also have a few other people under my belt, including 1 or 2 country artists. So, things are good. Shante now is making more money now from Hip Hop than she ever made when she was hipping and hopping.

You left rap for school. Most artists do vice versa. What made you make that decision?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: Well, it wasn’t a hard decision to make. It was the fact that I knew that if I wanted to be the type of mom that I wanted to be, you have to have other things to fall back on when it comes to Hip Hop because that is so fickle. And I’ve watched so many artists put their life into ‘this is how its gonna be, this is what is gonna be’ and then when it doesn’t turn out or pan out the way they want it, then you have people needing therapy.

Is that were you come in?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: Exactly; I’m there when they start the record. I’m there before they go get a record.

Have you ever sat down with any hip hop artists in therapy?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: Yes, I have and quite a few. I choose not to disclose their names but quite a few. And it works out very good.

What do you find the most that they often complain about in regards to music? Is it not having money?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: No. They mainly complain about not having peace of mind. Not being able to be themselves. Not being able to tell who’s who and what’s what. Not knowing what people’s motives are. Feeling scared, feeling threatened; afraid of getting old.

Back in the day, it was simple. It was more about your skill. How do you see Hip Hop today?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: Well now it’s more about their finances; their wealth. They don’t want to lose that. You talking about artists who make millions of dollars, who compared to us, make thousands of dollars. And their main fear factor is what if I lose all my money? How am I going to go back? Where am I going to go back to? Basically. You can’t have someone like Ludacris go broke because where is going to go back to?

In regards to education; Bill Cosby has been making comments on not just artists but black people who invest $500 on a pair of sneakers instead of on Hooked on Phonics. Do you feel artists promote getting an education? Any comment to that mommy Shante?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: Well, I purchased Hooked on Phonics and I find that it wasn’t worth the $500. So, I felt as though maybe I should have bought a pair of sneakers because obviously the Hooked on Phonics didn’t turn out to be nothing but something my son used to step on to get to Hip Hop books. And they never take it back. So, Hooked on Phonics didn’t work for us.

But do you think artists spend more money on new “toys” so to speak and less on education? Or promoting stay in school for that matter?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: Well the most successful hip hop artists now are educated. But they don’t glorify that. You don’t hear Puffy discuss is Howard days and the fact that he went to college. You don’t hear how Master P; he and his wife, both were attending college. You don’t hear a lot of rappers speak out and say a lot of that is because I am educated. And it’s true. Education has a lot to do with it. And right now in the industry…the reason why a lot of street people feel that can’t talk and get involved with these AR’s; they say these A&R’s are out of touch, is because a lot of these A&R’s are college graduates. So, when some one comes to them saying Yo I wanna get a deal. This is what’sup and they’re really not feeling it. It’s a lack of communication. And I find myself …my son is 18 and when my son talks to me, I have to tell him “And what does that mean?” And I hold a degree. And he’s like “Ma…well that means…” And I’m like; well tell me what that means because I don’t get it. And that shows there is beginning to be a gap, between mothers and children now. And then you have some moms who want to be young and want to talk that way. I just can’t do it.

Do you mean when mothers talk “Ebonics” to their children?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: Yeah when mothers only know Ebonics to teach their children.

I read your bio. Basically, it says your coming back with something new and hot for the streets. Is this true?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: I had so many different book deals on the table because a lot of people wanted me to tell the “Shante” story because they found it to be fascinating. I don’t want to say I’m fascinating but because I was able to reach millions of fans, that’s what broadened the Shante story. But it’s the same story that goes on everyday in the hood. Young girl meets older guy, has baby. Is manipulated and forced into things that she doesn’t want to do and then does them anyway. Basically, that’s happening everyday. That’s happening to someone right now. That’s also why I do a lot of speaking and things like that. Because I don’t want that to be a factor for anyone else. I go and I tell them, listen, you don’t have to go and do these things in order to get these things.

Having an 18 year old and an 8 year old is a real big age difference.
Dr. Roxanne Shante: Yes. And I was a different mom for each one.

And how would you explain that?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: Because my first son, I got pregnant at 14. I turned 15, 10 days before he was born. And he was a dress up doll to me. I had him for the same reasons a lot of young women have babies because they want something cute. I thought it was cute to push a stroller around. I thought it was going to be cute to dress him up. No one told me about pampers, teething, he has to walk, and he has to talk. Nobody told me that when he becomes 6 you’re going to have to be settled because he’s just gonna have to go to one school. In order for him to learn your phone number, your gonna have to pay you phone bill because he can’t keep learning different phone numbers all the time. No one told me the hard part about it. All they were thinking was, yeah, Roxanne’s having a baby and at one time, I even had parents picking outside of my concerts because I brought my son everywhere I went. And that was just me. And I breast fed. Which people thought was out of the norm. I come from a nationality were we believe in that. I’m Cuban and Antigen. We don’t believe in feeding cows milk. I’m not raising a cow. I’m raising a child. So, I had no choice. So you can imagine me on stage with a coca cola shirt on and all of a sudden your seeing these spots starting to come and then somebody runs out and give me a jean jacket so I can put on top my shirt so I can finish my show, but my breast are engorged. And I’m just turning 15.

There were girls watching and idolizing you. I remember the first time I heard you on the radio. It had to be like an hour or so after the ball dropped. And it was saying “World Premiere” and you just heard this little voice blasting on the radio. Everybody came running in the room like what’s that. Do you remember that day?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: Yeah, I remember. Let me tell you. I remember the first time I heard the record itself on the radio. And I was living with my mom. We were already going through something and I was in a group home and I just happened to be in the projects. So I just stopped by and stayed at my mom’s house and I remember her phone ringing like 2:00 in the morning and all I kept saying was this woman is going to lose her mind, if that call is for me. So I was actually praying that somebody had died so that this way, I won’t have to go through some situation with my mom. Oh you got people calling my house this late at night...da da da. So, I go run and snatch up the phone and said hello? And they said you on the radio, you on the radio. So, I hung up. So, they called back again and they were like you on the radio, you got here this, you on the radio Shante. And I was like they gonna get me put out (laughing). They gonna get me put out, that’s it, its over. She done got up, done turned on the kitchen light. And this was back in the days were you had one phone in the house.

I know (laughing).
Dr. Roxanne Shante: And it was way in the kitchen on the wall. And it had rung so loud. That big heavy phone; were your mother got that big extension to it. The curly cord, were you can extend it all the way from the kitchen all the way to the bedroom. I’m talking about that phone. The type of phone will you can still put the lock on to keep people from rotary dialing.

I know, the little gold metal lock on the dial (laughing).
Dr. Roxanne Shante: Ok! And you know on the side of the phone, the little slide thing that says loud, louder, loudest.

Yeah. I was about to say that little plastic one. Well, that was the updated one. The old one had the gold dial that was hard to push and no matter how low you set it, it would still ring loud.
Dr. Roxanne Shante: Yeah (laughing). Or like hit the receiver till it clicks and the operator would come on. And you’d be like, can you connect me… (Laughing). Well, anyway, the fact was I thought I was put out. And the next day my mother was like, look, I can’t take this no more…da, da, da. And she was like go and do my laundry. So I said ok, let me go and do her laundry. So I went to do the laundry. Everybody came running to the Laundromat. Aw Shante, I heard your record on the radio. Aw, Roxanne Roxanne. And I was just laughing it off. And all I kept saying through my mind was, I just made this record so that Marley Marl would give me a pair of Sergio Valente Jeans. So, I went to Marley’s house and was like where’s my pants, you put the record on the radio; I mean you played the tape, because it was a tape. It wasn’t even a record. That’s why it sounds so horrible. And I was like listen "where’s my jeans?" And he was like, “I’m gonna get your jeans but listen, these people are going to give you $1500 if you go and do it again.” And I was like I can’t. I’m doing laundry. And he was like “No, we’ll help you do the laundry. We’ll help you do the laundry.” And I was like no. My mother don’t like anybody touching her clothes. My mother was like very strict. And I’m down there doing her laundry and their sitting there biting their nails. And they say well go tell your mother we’ll buy her a washer and dryer. So, I’m like, you go tell her. So we go upstairs and they like, listen Ms. Peggy and she’s like I don’t wanna hear no shit. She gotta do my laundry; I don’t care what’s going on. And I was like ma, they said they gonna give me $1500, they had it in cash. And she was like what’s this money for? Now what are you getting ready to do? It wasn’t a happy situation.

It wasn’t like she was happy you were on radio. It was just like what are you about to get into now.
Dr. Roxanne Shante: Yeah. And it was like; I never wanted to be rapper. And that was the case. I didn’t want to be a rapper. That was not the case. Rap was not for me. I felt like I didn’t want to do that. I had my mind focused on so many other things that I wanted to do. And that wasn’t one of them.

You talk about your mom being real strict. Is that why you became pregnant so early; because your mom had such a tight string on you?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: I’m gonna tell you why I got pregnant. Because I wasn’t pregnant then. I wasn’t pregnant till I got out of my household. I became “Roxanne”, get a little money and basically, I could do what I want to do. The man fully took advantage of that. He was 18 years my elder. He took advantage of that. It was no secret.

This happens all the time in entertainment with young girls. What advice would you offer them?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: The fact is, I try to keep young ladies from having to “fuck for fame.” Because it’s…I’m very blunt with them. I’m very truthful with them. You go into these studios, it’s late at night, and these guys are picking you up. He’s telling you that he’s feeling you. He feels that you’re going to be something; it’s gonna happen for you and this and that. And in all reality you wind up fucking for fame. So now, you not only have to fuck the person who helps you write your shit. But you gotta fuck the producer. Next thing you know, you fucking for studio time, you know, until you fucked out. And they don’t even put you out. They wind up signing some chick that don’t even like guys.

Damn, that’s deep. So what about now, present day?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: And now it’s a fact where…and now it’s worst. It’s horrible. In comparison to men. Because I got away with a lot of things because I was a cute little girl. And at that time, men still did it. But it was still Taboo to fuck around with someone so much younger than you.

As in the case with the accusations of R.Kelly?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: But let me tell you, R. Kelly is not the first and he is not the last. That’s why I couldn’t understand, with them putting so much pressure on R. Kelly about it because they were saying he did this, he did that. But, men have always been doing that. Always. Relatives bring them there. That’s just a fact of hoing’ and pimpin’ a situation. And they have always done that. Always. That’s not a secret. It just seems to be OK until you’re in your 30s and he’s in his 50s. But they fuck them from 14 and younger, till all the way up.

What do you talk to girls about when you are in sessions with them?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: When I talk to young girls; it’s about everything. From rap to molestation, to being a teen mom, to being ridiculed as a group home girl and being a runaway in the streets; it’s because I was all of them. And it’s because deep down…I still am one of them.

The artists that are being managed by their parents; do you think those are being saved?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: I would say that those are being saved from a lot. But are they being saved? I can’t say. But I think they are saved from a lot of other bullshit that they could be going thru, yes. Yes, definitely, they are. Even your parents’ presence means a lot. There are certain things people won’t do or say because your parents are present. But when you’re just on your own and you just straight out the group home. Ain’t no telling what they are gonna do. A majority of my shows…Marley Marl…they took fully advantage of that. They would say, you know Shante, it’s customary when you do a show, that your suppose to split your money, evenly, with everyone. So, there was no one to tell me that wasn’t true. So, I did that for years. I didn’t realize that you’re the headline Shante. And they get the rest. No one ever said Shante this is how it goes.

You find that now, these rappers are more educated?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: Yeah. And I thank God for that. They come fully equipped with lawyers. They know your lawyer shouldn’t know your accountant, your accountant shouldn’t know record company. Your record company shouldn’t be friends with the Tax person. They realize it. Cause they know that. They come fully equipped.

And for those who don’t know, they shouldn’t know each other because that means they are trying to get over?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: Right. They should never have a connection. And the reason why they shouldn’t have a connection is because when one is making you angry then they other will say what they were doing is right.

With all that you know now. All the lessons that you have learned. Would you do it again?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: (Sigh) I don’t know. I really can’t say if I would or not because …a part of me…if I could start all over from the beginning…the very beginning again? Would I have went to Marley’s house? Would I have made a record? Yes. I would have. Would I have stayed? No. Would I have dealt with the publishing stealing and the writing stealing and having to go through so many changes to retrieve it back and stuff like that? No.

What would you change?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: The first thing that I would have done; and this is not me throwing this out there for free advertising or anything but, the best thing I ever did was sign with The Royalty Network. And I didn’t sign with The Royalty Network until recently. And if I’d known about them; the first time I would have made a record, I would have signed with The Royalty Network. The Royalty Network takes over where Suge Knight’s intentions left off. When Suge came into the industry; he came into the industry as a savior. We looked at Suge like, OK great, who’s going to be next to go to Suge. So Suge can get it right. Because Suge was getting you out of contracts that had you like a slave. Suge was getting you money that they owed you. Suge was getting your royalties right. Suge was getting your publishing back. Suge was even retrieving your masters. But, once he retrieved them, then you were tied to Suge. And greed set on him and you were tied to him. But The Royalty Network does the same exact thing were his intentions set off and they do it without you having to be tied down.

Forget doing it all over again. If someone came at you with a record deal, knowing what you know now. And you had the opportunity to get back in the game, right now, would you?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: Yeah. With a vengeance. Yes I would.

What does a vengeance mean?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: When I say with a vengeance; not with a revengeful thing, but that means bigger, better and badder than before. Yes, I would. But it would take a special, special company and special, special circumstances…like if you ever here something in the future whether near or far, hear about Roxanne Shante doing something again as far as musically? Know for a fact that that has to be an incredible deal. Because I spoke to the sister, so I know, whoever came to the table came right and I know that the contract was proper and I know that she is totally happy on the front side and the back end. Yes, definitely.

You talked about being a different mother to both of your children.
Dr. Roxanne Shante: Yes.

What type of mother were you with your son?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: With my son, I learned the difference between when you want someone to have your back and when you want someone to have your front. And with that, I must say, that with my son I was like, don’t worry about it baby, yeah I got your back, I got your back. And I realized that in order to have someone back that means they must first tackle what is going on and then you don’t hold them down. But when I realized that that was not the way to do it; I started to have a front, which means my daughter benefited from having a front, which means whatever was getting ready to come at me first had to go through me first to get to her.

Would you say your son was cheated a mom because you were so young and weren’t equipped to handle it?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: He wasn’t cheated out of anything. If anything he had more than just a mom, he had a sister and a friend. And sometimes that’s were we mess up with our children. When we step out of the mothers position and what to be sisters and friends and cool with them. So he had that. And I thank God that he was a boy. Because I took him into clubs, he got to travel; he got to do this and to do that. But I can’t say I ever remember sitting in the bed with him, reading him a bedtime story. I didn’t get a chance to go to Teacher Conferences at first. There are so many things that he didn’t get a chance to experience with me. But he still turned out excellent. But then the world was a different place then.

When was the point when you were like, enough of this shit; I’m gone do my son and do me?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: When I was living in Newark, N.J. and I called up the record company and I said my husband just got sentenced 20 to life for Cop killing. And what do I do? And they were like Well, I don’t know. Because see my husband had posed such a threat to them at one time. So, when they realized that the threat was gone, it changed. They got real different with me. Yeah call us back. Yeah we’ll see you. Yeah, it’s in the mail And I was like, you know what? I’ve never been a beggar or borrower. In my younger days, I was a thief. No way I’m gonna allow anyone to pull me out of my position, knowing how I am, how I felt about myself.

I’ve always been very proud. My self-esteem has always been great. And I was not gonna let them break it. And I was not gonna mess with a million drug dealers to keep my life style the way I wanted it. So instead, I went and pursued education. So I called them up and said listen, is it possible that ya’ll can at least by me some books? They said yeah yeah yeah, we’ll get you a Barnes and Noble gift certificate. Because I said you can get me a Barnes and Noble gift certificate because you can write that off. Still not knowing that I was entitled to royalties, publishing’s, writers…not knowing this. Not knowing that they were spoon feeding me, my own meal. And I’m waiting at Barnes and Noble, I should have a gift certificate…never, never. And the thing that really made me break down was in my second semester of Psych 101 and I was attending Mary Mount University; my deans’ name was Dean Greco; I stood next to a copy machine with a roll of fucking nickels, trying to copy 433 pages of a Psychology…Understanding Psychology. But I have the book now. And a Chinese girl actually; her name was Lillian Nung let me hold her book and the reason why their names and the dates and the times and the book and everything, because that was such a significant day in my life. I sat there, with my baby, on my hip, feeding nickels to the machine, trying to copy that book. Page for page for page for page. But I couldn’t afford to buy it. But my Dean came out and said “You’ve been here for like hours, what are you doing?” And I was like; I’m up to like page 244 or 45. And…girl, I am crying now, telling you about it. (Sigh) And she said don’t copy no more pages because I’m gonna get you a copy of that book. Because I know that your gonna make it. And from that day on, I said fuck hip hop and all it had to offer. With all the rappers that were Shante this and Shante that…I wasn’t getting high. Never did I choose to get high. But if I wanted to get high it seems like ya’ll would have gladly got me that, but ya’ll didn’t want to get me books? But you want to see me in a club, buy me bottles of champagne but you couldn’t get me a Barnes and Noble… It just showed me where people’s heads were at and it kind of shook me up and took me for a loop. But I was like, you know what, Lord and I’ve never been religious and still to this day I’m not a very religious person, you can tell from my language, but I do recognize that there is a God and I do recognize that I am blessed. And I said order my steps from this point on and I will never look to Hip Hop for anything ever again. And honey, I just kept it moving. And before you know it, I was socking it to them for education because they had to keep paying my tuition. They just didn’t have to pay for my books and lab. So, they figured that if she’s not going to be able to pay for her books and lab then she is not going to be able to afford to do this. And I socked it to them. So much so that they offered me money, not to go to school; like ok, listen, we can buy you out for the rest of this. And I refused it.

So wait. Was it getting too expensive? Were they trying to lure you back in to rap fulltime?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: Yeah, because I was going to Cornell for Pre-Med studies because I was going to be psychiatrist and when they realized that that was running into the $70,000 a year mark, they were like wow, listen. Because they realized that they could not back up at of that clause. And I still refused it. Lord knows I could have used that money. But I still refused it.

In the new Beef II DVD, you talked about that particular clause. How did that clause come into affect?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: They were like, she’s a young teenage mother, and she done already fucked up her life. She’s not gonna go to school. And if she does, she’s just gonna get a little degree. So, we’ll give her that 7500 dollars clause or whatever because she’s probably gonna windup going to a city college…if that. Because she ain’t even graduated High School. We got her traveling around the world, she’s probably gonna get on drugs. They had already predicted how fucked up they felt my future was gonna be. And I still signed. Still not taking no advances, still not taking…I mean, they socked it to me. I mean, the Shante Story is a horrible one. And it just turned out good but as for the book deals and different things like that. The reason why I haven’t sat down…I mean, we finished, basically, one part of it. But when I’m talking about one part, we finished like a 3 part novel book series. Because I’ve only lived just a few chapters of my life. And it may have seemed that it was horrible and so bad…but it was. There were days when I was contemplating suicide because I just didn’t want no one to see Shante fucked up. But then I realized that I’ve been a mom, more than I’ve been anything else in my life. So what happens to him (son) if I would have done that? But I was pushed tot hat point. And that really made me more so that I really wanted to study psychology. Because I needed to know, if this is pushing me to my breaking point, I know that there are so many other people who need help getting to their breaking point. And that’s what made Shante, Shante now. And yeah, so they give me a lot of invitations to a lot of different places and yeah, a lot of times, I don’t show. And if I don’t show, a majority of the time they will say, yeah she won’t show because she’s this, it might be this way, it might be that way. But that’s not the reason. A lot of times I don’t show because life is that good, that I remember what it is that I’ve said and I choose not to reflect on it and not to reflect on the phoniness and things like that. But I love music, don’t get me wrong. I love it. There’s not a day that goes by that I don’t sit back and look at other rappers and say I’m much better than that, much better than that. Much better than that. But still chose to say, I am living much better than that.

Do you think your children will follow after you and go into the industry?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: If they do, their going prepared. Their sword is extremely sharp. And if they do go, their going alright.

You’re in a different time in your life. Do you tribute that to that day with the book?
Dr. Roxanne Shante: I was telling you, sorry for getting so emotional. But I stood there with my son, who was falling asleep, on my hip, trying to copying every page of that book. So, what I did was, when I got financially right. Which didn’t take long; and I went a got a brand new copy of that book. And it’s called Understanding Psychology by Robert S. Feldman. It’s the 3 rd Edition. And I brought that book and I have it inside of a glass case in my living room with my degrees. And 4 nickels cause I only had 4 nickels; those same 4 nickels.

Dr. Roxanne Shante can be reached at drroxanneshante@aol.com